Loader Mutt Continues...

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DaveKamp
Posts: 522
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:19 am
First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
Location: LeClaire, Ia

Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

So now that the bearings and seals are in place, and the hubs are fitted, the next step is making up the axleshafts... which means taking the Mustang shafts and either MAKE a flange (cut, drill, machine in a recess, etc) or liberate flanges from the donor Dana 60, bore them to accept the Mustang axle shafts, and weld them, true them up, etc., The flanges have 8 holes which slip over the hub's drive studs... but the holes on the flanges are countersunk to accept little tapered spacers, which substantially improve the ability of these studs to hold the flange in, and transmit torque. Not that we'd be exceeding what the Dana60's capacity would ever be, but the tapered things keep the flange from working around whilst doing their job... and that taper isn't something I have a ready tooling setup to cut well... so I'm going with reworking the Dana60 flanges.

Now, just for sake of trying, I attempted to cut off the axle flanges with a bandsaw, and of course, they're forged and hardened, so they just laughed at the saw. I broke out the torch, and burned one off.
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Then, I took a file and tried to scuff into it, and yeah, it was like trying to file a round glass tube... the flange had been induction hardened to the moon... so time to anneal. Just so happens that several months back, I came across a gent who had a pottery kiln in his garage, and he desperately wanted that floor space, but the kiln was too big, and too heavy, and not valuable enough to find a seller, so I got it for FREE... brought it home, did some basic repairs, cut an inspection hole in the lid, covered it with several pieces of refractory brick, hooked it to power in my grain bin, placed this flange, and a tin can of aluminum scraps in, and turned the kiln on.
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The can of aluminum scraps is really just there to prove the temperature.
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
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First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

The eerie orange glow peeping out through the lid says it's over 1800F in there, and I expect that after an hour or so, that axle flange was a large percentage of that glow. I shut it down, and walked away for a day, to allow the flange to cool REALLY SLOW.
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Next day, I fished out my bounty (it was still a little warm)...
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and visited it with the file AGAIN, and it cut in nicely!
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So I chucked it in the lathe to bore out the center...
Attachments
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Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

I chucked it up in the lathe, bored it out to a snug fit on the axle, set it to proper length, then welded the flange in tight, once cooled, I put it back in the lathe, and skimmed the back end to be true-running to the shaft's axis.
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Cleaned up the hardware, installed gasket, and the hardware, socked it down... and now one side is done!
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Time to repeat the process for the other side...
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

davis2
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Location: Quantico,MD (Formerly from Lee Center,NY)

Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by davis2 »

Keep the updates coming! Love following the progress.

DaveKamp
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First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

So it took some effort, but I finally found the stray axleshaft... tall weeds took over, I had to battle my way through summer's overgrowth until yesterday dark... but a stroll through my work revealed it's hiding place.

I promptly took it down for a visit with Lucifer's Toothpick (oxyacetylene torch) and liberated the flanged from axleshaft, took it to the kiln (along with a can of aluminum scraps) and started the heating/annealing process...
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
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First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

Oooh... pretty red glow inside the hotbox! :twisted:
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Annealing is accomplished by heating the metal to about 100F above it's critical temperature (around 1300F for most steels), and then 'soak' it... hold it at that temp for an hour for each inch of thickness (under 3/4" for this one), and then cool it at about 70F per hour 'till it's down below 500F.

The cooling process started two hours ago, so by this time tomorrow, it should be ready to go in the lathe.

I may not get to it right away, though... there's some things on the honey-do list that need attention before Friday... but we'll see.

By the way, if you THINK that YOU can't do this... think again. The kiln I'm using, I acquired for free... it's old, tired, and needs TLC, but it still gets hot... and that's all that matters here. Nothing special, it's connected to a 240v/50A outlet, and just does what it's supposed to do... warm up, hold temp, then turn off, and cool slowly.
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

So HERE is the old Paragon kiln... pretty much cooled off as of 6pm tonight, so the annealing process is about 20 hours, I could have probably pulled it out by noon and then cooled the last several hundred in the air, but I was at work...
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Here's what it looked like when I lifted the lid. Notice the steel can's contents (aluminum angle iron) is now melted into a round block...
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and the flange has a new color... a reddish hue...
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A visit from the file says it is ready to machine!!!
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:19 am
First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
Location: LeClaire, Ia

Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

So it's late, I'm tired, and got lotta things I gotta do 'tween now and Friday 2pm, so I'll let the pictures yield 8 thousand words:
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Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:19 am
First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
Location: LeClaire, Ia

Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

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Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:19 am
First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
Location: LeClaire, Ia

Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

So my office desk, before lunch...
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And after lunch...
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Can 'ya figure out what changed?
Yes- the Dr. Pepper is gone!!! :lol: :lol:

Here it is again... in situ:
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Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

davis2
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by davis2 »

I'll be seriously bummed when you finish the project. I've followed this thread for years now! Thank you for documenting this.

DaveKamp
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First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

Well, thanks for chiming in, Dave!

I don't know if I could come up with a way of making it last any longer... I mean... I'm managing such infrequent progress, that a snail, riding a frozen turtle through a 14" concrete wall would make faster progress than ME! :lol:

Obviously, it's not my ONLY project... there's probably over a dozen more going on, but the most important (the new shop) has made NO progress since before the knee injury, but I'm hoping I can get some forward motion here before Christmas... If I could get six holes dug, piers formed and poured for the souty wing, and whilst doing that, three more holes dug, piers formed and poured for the lean-to that'll provide covered protection on north side of the grainery building... that'd be great, too... but I don't think time and finances will permit that... we'll see once the propane tanks get their initial fill.
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
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First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

Okay, so today I did a half-zillion things, including draining and blowing out my Dad's outdoor water lines (mom's gardens have LOTS of spigots), and I cut and welded up a proper cover for an in-ground box in my front yard... loaded steel onto a buddy's trailer, unloaded a hydraulic shear off same buddy's trailer, put down sealant on the new henhouse concrete floor...

And more...

But I squeeked in some time to get the second axleshaft assembled.

I did the same process... assembled, welded it up, cleaned up all the hardware, assembled, checked depth, pulled it out, ground a little off the end of the shaft (too deep) then assembled again.
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Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

After welding the flange in, it must be cooled, then trued-up, because the back of the flange will INVARIABLY not be perpendicular to the axleshaft SOMEWHERE. Skimming the back solves this. Skimming the OD cleans up the look.
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And some yellow rattle-paint gives it protection and color.
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

JMotuzick
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by JMotuzick »

Per the usual I’m speechless to your work! Keep up the posts because I am reading!

DaveKamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

So today's toil was outdoor-get-ready-for-winter stuff. That included, but not limited to:

Installing a new driveway sensor, fabricating a cover for the pull box, and getting the wire pulled through, cover installed, and dirt spread over the cover..
Digging a drainaget trench to release water trapped on the north side of the grainery...
Pushing a huge mess of leaves from the west side of the yard, into a pile
Getting the henhouse reassembled enough to move the young chickens out of the brooder, into the pen...

And then a little more work on the transaxle. I corrected some fastener issues with the side housings... I'm short two 3/8-16 studs, but the rest are in and ready... and I put a coat of yellow paint on the center casting:

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Next steps include... getting it lifted off the workstand, wheels/tires installed (so I can roll it around), a hydrostat installed, rear cover installed, new top cover (with dipstick/filler and probably some other features)...

Then time to bring Loader Mutt into the shop, yank the busted up rear, and roll this new one into position!
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

DaveKamp
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First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

I've had all of yesterday and today sitting behind the wheel, driving to my next assignment, and now as I sit in a hotel room in Lubbock, Texas, I'm still pondering a couple other things I want to do here.

First... I've been consdering plumbing the live hydraulics pump into the transaxle, along with another hydraulic reservoir.

The Johnson 20 loader's original hydraulic reservoir, is the left-side stanchion. Not a whole lotta volume there. I've seen guys plumb the OTHER side in, to double the volume. They draw from one side, and return on the other, which is a good idea... but it means there's more plumbing going to those stanchions, and I've managed to bust one of the fittings off (I was being a bit energetic in some work somewhere, and bumped into a piece of concrete).

I also want the entire hydraulic system to come up to temperature together... to be equallized... meaning, the transaxle and the steering, the lift and curl. When it's cold out, I start it up, and the transaxle comes up to temperature at one point, but the steering and bucket don't. I use a magnetic electric heater to help it out during winter, but that only warms up ONE... and of course, I have to check TWO fluid levels. They're both running HyTran Ultra, so it's not like mixing will be a problem...

What I'm thinking, is that if I make a tank that is well-protected somewhere, and use IT as a return, and tie it into the transaxle. Haven't decided HOW, but I want a convenient filler and dipstick on the transaxle, which will easily be added to the trans cover under the seat.

Please stand by... I'm pondering.
technical difficulty- please stand by.JPG
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Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

davis2
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by davis2 »

Take your time... Just keep up the updates!

DaveKamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

I think it's just you and Joe, Dave...

Btw, Joe- is it passenger & freight elevators, or grain elevators? (I used to work for Mongomery... then Montgomery-KONE... a long time ago...)
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

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dag1450
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by dag1450 »

The finished axle looks amazing. It looks like something for a big Minneapolis Moline...not a little cub cadet. Lol. Enjoy your write ups!
127, 1650, 1572, 1872, 2072 . A mower, blower and blade for each.

dgrapes59
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by dgrapes59 »

I have also enjoyed following your progress. Your attention to detail and skill level is quite impressive, far beyond my abilities, but fun to see a master at work!

Keep them coming and best of luck,

David

DaveKamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

Wow! Three Daves and a Joe! :lol: how'd THAT happen?

Master? Not even close... I could be considerably more meticulous about this stuff, but the result would not be significantly better in any functional way.

If I were to do it again, I would likely not do SOME things different, but I MIGHT do it for a different reason (like... a tracked vehicle!!!)

At this point, I'm picking away just to get it to the point where I can get Mutt pulled into the garage, get the busted-up rearend out, get the frame modified to accept this new one (it'll have some dimensional disagreements), get the tires refilled with fluid, snow chains on, lights working, and bucket on, so it'll be available to push snow...
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

JMotuzick
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by JMotuzick »

Dave
I’m in CT we don’t have grain elevators!

I’m with Schindler, 16 years now….

davis2
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by davis2 »

DaveKamp wrote:
Sun Oct 30, 2022 10:29 am
Wow! Three Daves and a Joe! :lol: how'd THAT happen?

Master? Not even close... I could be considerably more meticulous about this stuff, but the result would not be significantly better in any functional way.

If I were to do it again, I would likely not do SOME things different, but I MIGHT do it for a different reason (like... a tracked vehicle!!!)

At this point, I'm picking away just to get it to the point where I can get Mutt pulled into the garage, get the busted-up rearend out, get the frame modified to accept this new one (it'll have some dimensional disagreements), get the tires refilled with fluid, snow chains on, lights working, and bucket on, so it'll be available to push snow...
When I went to work for Nutrena Feeds in 1987, there were 5 Dave's there. I got a nickname, Leroy... I still answer to that some...

davis2
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by davis2 »

DaveKamp wrote:
Sat Oct 29, 2022 9:56 pm
I think it's just you and Joe, Dave...

Btw, Joe- is it passenger & freight elevators, or grain elevators? (I used to work for Mongomery... then Montgomery-KONE... a long time ago...)
Grain elevators are so much fun... Changing drive belts in a thunderstorm really shows your insanity. I also learned what a wrench does when dropped 100 feet onto a metal roof. Standing next to a pellet leg while the belt breaks really tests how well you can keep from crapping your pants. Yeah, so much fun...

DaveKamp
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

Hi Guys!

No immediate progress since I got back from my run to Lubbock, I'm busy getting caught up for winter... but soon.

Joe- when someone says a guy "Wrote the book" on... that 'guy' was me... the holeless and in-grounds, tractions, and controllers... so I spent plenty of time running the car-top controls, replacing roller and slide guides, catalogueing buffers, setting up governors and identifying wiring for resolvers, hatch access switches, and adjusting MAXTON UC1A's... geez, that was a long time ago...

Dunno if a branch of your outfit has any connections, but if they do, Schindler at the Sleep Inn and Suites in Park City (Wicheta Ks) has something going on with either a guide, or a track bracket, halfway between the 2nd and 3rd floor... it exhibits a little cab-distortion and a jarring like mebbie it's got a loose rail clip or something.

Dave- I've spent enough time on grain elevators, installing antennas. Local HAM club has a repeater atop a grain tower about 4 miles westish of me, the repeater cabinet sits atop the bin roof at 230ft, and our coaxial hardline goes up another 25ft of building, across the roof a ways, then to a railing where our multi-bay dipole calls home. Vibrations from the transport literally rattle the cable connections loose after about 2 months, and even with the cabinet sealed, it STILL gets dusty in there, so we go up (in the tiny man-lift) and snug everything back down, vac out the crud, and close it up again.

Tonight, I'm assembling an electric chicken-door operator. It's basically an old busted Genie garage door opener that's been shortened down to just ONE track section. Like all the other cheap-crap garage door openers, the Genie 2202 (?) has a plastic gear in the worm reducer that drives the chain pinion. It's basically the same tensile strength as 6-day-old Cheeze-Wiz. Now, lots of OTHER companies use a plastic gear (they're all crap too), but if you go looking on Genie's site for THIS opener, you'll see that the gear and shaft are NOT available, you hafta buy the whole danged motor for $150 + shipping.

The motor for this one is DC, which, if it was worth a crap, would be PERFECT for use as-is, shortened down, stripped of it's electronics, and run by an Arduino, to ring a bell and open at sunup, and ring a bell once, wait 45 seconds, ring it twice, then close about 40 minutes after sundown... with the open and close times for the motor to be about 15 seconds.

I went looking through my stores to see just what I had.. I found one PERFECT candidate, a 12vdc motor with bronze worm gear setup originally from a very small anchor windlass who's mounting stuff was all shot... but the motor and worm unit ran great, so I popped out the shaft, put it in a collet, in my homemade hex-body 5c collet holder. I put a milling bit in the Bridgeport and chewed it into a perfect hex fit with the Genie chain sprocket. I mounted the motor onto the opener's plate, now I need to conjoin the plate to the track, nix all the excess metal, and then make the mounting brackets, recut the arm for the chicken door, etc., then make the Arduino sketch to make this thing work...
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

JMotuzick
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by JMotuzick »

Dave
I can’t help sorry. If it’s a Schindler product Lilly a 330a hydro it’s a POS tin foil rails stamped steel, they are NOT straight. There are no roller guides, plastic shoes, built into the stile. Sooo as the rail is not straight the cab moves with the twisted rail and sounds like it’s coming apart!

Keep us posted as progress is made….

davis2
Posts: 223
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Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by davis2 »

DaveKamp wrote:
Mon Nov 07, 2022 9:45 pm
Hi Guys!

No immediate progress since I got back from my run to Lubbock, I'm busy getting caught up for winter... but soon.

Joe- when someone says a guy "Wrote the book" on... that 'guy' was me... the holeless and in-grounds, tractions, and controllers... so I spent plenty of time running the car-top controls, replacing roller and slide guides, catalogueing buffers, setting up governors and identifying wiring for resolvers, hatch access switches, and adjusting MAXTON UC1A's... geez, that was a long time ago...

Dunno if a branch of your outfit has any connections, but if they do, Schindler at the Sleep Inn and Suites in Park City (Wicheta Ks) has something going on with either a guide, or a track bracket, halfway between the 2nd and 3rd floor... it exhibits a little cab-distortion and a jarring like mebbie it's got a loose rail clip or something.

Dave- I've spent enough time on grain elevators, installing antennas. Local HAM club has a repeater atop a grain tower about 4 miles westish of me, the repeater cabinet sits atop the bin roof at 230ft, and our coaxial hardline goes up another 25ft of building, across the roof a ways, then to a railing where our multi-bay dipole calls home. Vibrations from the transport literally rattle the cable connections loose after about 2 months, and even with the cabinet sealed, it STILL gets dusty in there, so we go up (in the tiny man-lift) and snug everything back down, vac out the crud, and close it up again.

Tonight, I'm assembling an electric chicken-door operator. It's basically an old busted Genie garage door opener that's been shortened down to just ONE track section. Like all the other cheap-crap garage door openers, the Genie 2202 (?) has a plastic gear in the worm reducer that drives the chain pinion. It's basically the same tensile strength as 6-day-old Cheeze-Wiz. Now, lots of OTHER companies use a plastic gear (they're all crap too), but if you go looking on Genie's site for THIS opener, you'll see that the gear and shaft are NOT available, you hafta buy the whole danged motor for $150 + shipping.

The motor for this one is DC, which, if it was worth a crap, would be PERFECT for use as-is, shortened down, stripped of it's electronics, and run by an Arduino, to ring a bell and open at sunup, and ring a bell once, wait 45 seconds, ring it twice, then close about 40 minutes after sundown... with the open and close times for the motor to be about 15 seconds.

I went looking through my stores to see just what I had.. I found one PERFECT candidate, a 12vdc motor with bronze worm gear setup originally from a very small anchor windlass who's mounting stuff was all shot... but the motor and worm unit ran great, so I popped out the shaft, put it in a collet, in my homemade hex-body 5c collet holder. I put a milling bit in the Bridgeport and chewed it into a perfect hex fit with the Genie chain sprocket. I mounted the motor onto the opener's plate, now I need to conjoin the plate to the track, nix all the excess metal, and then make the mounting brackets, recut the arm for the chicken door, etc., then make the Arduino sketch to make this thing work...
We had a pillow block bearing catch on fire one night. Even though the bearing was outside the elevator, it sucked smoke into the plant, so I go up there to put it out, then to drench any possible embers in the soybean meal bin. A sane person would have just left. But I'm not sane.

DaveKamp
Posts: 522
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:19 am
First and Last Name: Dave Kamp
Location: LeClaire, Ia

Re: Loader Mutt Continues...

Post by DaveKamp »

A Fireman is a guy who's crazy enough to run INTO a burning building, while all the SANE people are running OUT! :lol: :lol:

But seriously folks...

I'm on a job assignment for the next few days. When I get home, I gotta round up 80ft of 4" drain tube, get it placed in a trench in the back of my property, get conduit, air line, water line etc., all in that trench, then get it backfilled, pull wire through some of the conduit, to get the grain bins' power restored, and then I'll be back at the regular projects. One of them will be to get Loader Mutt pulled out of the grain bin, and placed inside the heated garage, get the old transaxle pulled out, get this new one fitted in, and a few other modifications/improvements done, so it'll be available to move snow. The 22hp Honda gasser starts SO much better than the Kubota 3cyl diesel... ;-)
Yes, I'm a Mad Scientist... but I'm usually happy, even when things ain't goin right.

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