1650 Fixes/Resto

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Lmercer
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First and Last Name: Lyle Mercer
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1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

I finally decided to fix the transmission leak in my hydro and fix the slop in the steering.

Well when I took it apart for these fixes I found that the steering column just came right out of the gear box. I decided to make a new column and do the super steering rebuild with a new stud follower, bearing at the top of the column and a thrust bearing and thrust washers on the pivot.
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I also found that there was a lot more rust than what I realized. I use this tractor to plow snow and I just can't replace it with the hydraulics as cheap as it is to fix it.
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Looking at everything else, I thought it needed cleaned up:
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I took off all the tins of the engine and repainted them:
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I treated the major rust:
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Now everything else is primed and will be getting ready for final paint:
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I have now built a paint booth to try and keep the bugs out!! I still have to cut my furnace filters in:
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Dan M.
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Dan M. »

Lyle, Looks like you got a case of the Saturday afternoon "might as well." Great job so far. It's a good feeling when you get all the primer on and next the paint. What paint and/or hardener will you use? I like the paint booth and filters, but I bet you're gonna get hot in there. I think everyone gets a surprise under the foot pads when you finally get them off. My first instinct is to grab the wire brush grinder and go after it, but you're suppose to leave a little rust on for the Extend stuff to work. Extend leaves a nice black finish; phosphoric acid leaves a white finish. Gonna do the cradle upgrade, too? Might as well. :D

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Hey Dan,

I picked up Case/IH Iron Gard Federal Yellow and the Case/IH Iron Gard White 935 today from the implement dealer today. They carry Cub paint as well but the Case/IH is cheaper.

They had Valspar 'Renew' hardner but it was like $38 a pint. I think I will just pick up the Valspar hardner that is at TSC.

I plan on putting a fan on the outside of the high side filters blowing in, trying to create a 'downdraft in the booth as the filters on the opposite wall will be down low.

I have watched a youtube series of a guy who documented his restoration complete with paining and he told me he reduced his paint 50/50, which is way more than the 8/1 the Iron Gard calls for.

I am going to mix a small amount at his ratio and try it on something that's not real critical. He also used a medium reducer from NAPA I am thinking about using also.

Dan M.
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Dan M. »

Did you use your sand blaster pressure pot on any of the parts? My compressor is to small to keep up with mine.

If you could get your paint booth out in the midday sun to shoot it, it would cook off nicely. And you'd have a pretty yellow square on your lawn.

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vince_o
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by vince_o »

I am going to mix a small amount at his ratio and try it on something that's not real critical. He also used a medium reducer from NAPA I am thinking about using also.
Lmercer


Hang on Lyle Ill bring a cub over and you can shoot it, belive me its NOT CRITICAL! LOL

Looks good. One thing I like about the cubs is once you have the eng out, fenders off, and the dash out for repairs, you may as well paint it! I really like the paint booth. I dont know why it is but there wont be a bug around you for miles and you start painting and they are there like flies on stink!
"It's a damn poor mind that can only think of one way to spell a word."
-Andrew Jackson

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Tim DeLooza
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Tim DeLooza »

“start painting and they are there like flies on stink” And hoods make a great landing strip/swimming pool.

Painting is always fun…

Lyle, I would definitely use an automotive reducer. I would also check out a cheaper/generic automotive hardener, rather than the valspar cans at TSC. I painted a couple things for a guy and he brought me the supplies to use. It was the valspar paint and hardener. It seemed to stay tacky for a couple days. I shot some of my own stuff with the same paint and an automotive hardener (think it was around 20-30 a can) and it was touchable the same day. I think you’ll find 50/50 is to thin. I usually end up around 4:2:1 (4 paint, 2 reducer, and 1 hardener).

I do like the paint booth too. You going to move it around on the floor between the yellow and white coats so you end up with a yellow and white checker board floor?

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Farmallgray
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Farmallgray »

Lyle,
Nice work and that tractor will look great when you are done.

I like your booth and I have thought about something similar myself. Is it going to have a door?

I may be misunderstanding your description of your fan system, but based on my interpretaion of what you wrote,
I do have one thought; if you are going to have the fan blowing into the booth, I would put a filter on the intake side of the fan as well. Otherwise the fan could be sucking up dust and blowing it into your booth.
See my IH, Cub Cadet and tractor pulling youtube videos;
http://www.youtube.com/user/farmallgray

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Thanks for all the tips and comments. I plan on putting a drop cloth on the floor since I don't want a Cub themed floor. :lol:

I did use the sand blaster on heavily rusted stuff. My compressor did OK, but I did wait on it a couple of times, as it is n ot a big one.

I am going to cut a slit in the plastic on 1 side for a door and then hang a piece of plastic over the slit like a 'curtain'.

As far as the fan goes, I plan on putting filters on 1 side up high and down low on the other side. On the outside of the booth, I plan on mounting the fan to blow through the high side filters into the booth, creating a positive pressure in the booth.

I have no idea how well this will work, I just have been reading about it on the internet and it seems the best way to keep overspray down in my shop.

I have an old Z28 sitting behind the paint booth with the interior out of it so I can't move it. Even though I'm going to cover it, I want to keep all overspray to a minimum.

Tim, I have no idea what the best ratio is. Do you remember what brand of hardener you used? The guy on the youtube videos only used a capful or two when he would mix his 50/50 ratio at about 16 ounces. At your ratio that would be 4 oz paint, 2 oz reducer and 1 oz hardener. Isn't that alot? The only reason I ask is that the hardener comes in such a smaller can than anything else.

Thanks,
Lyle

p.s. I got most of it wet sanded today. I can't wait to see how the paint is going to turn out! :D

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mgonitzke
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by mgonitzke »

That sounds really thin. The thinnest I think I have ever mixed paint was the PPG Shop Line paint for the 100 I redid last summer, and that was 8:1:1 or so IIRC.
Original, 582 w/ 18 hp Kohler Command, 682 w/ Kwik-Way loader, 782, 782D, 1872 My Cub Site

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Tim DeLooza
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Tim DeLooza »

Lyle, The PPG Omni paint I use for the IH901 calls for a 4:1:1 mix. That paint is a fair amount thinner to start than the Cub Cadet, Case Iron Guard, or Valspar paint from TSC. I’ve mixed the CC paint at the 4:1:1 but it doesn’t really work, it doesn’t spray well, that’s why I thin it more.

The generic hardener I’ve used the most is PPG MH101. As I remember its like $38 for 16oz (1 pint). The last time I got some the counter man told me he has some cheaper “generic” hardener, so I got some to try. It is Duragloss AE397. It was about $20 for a 16oz can. So far it’s been fine too. As I remember it the TSC Valspar hardener was in pretty small containers, and had a different mixing ratio. What ever you decide to get, follow the ratios on the can and you should be fine.

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Farmallgray
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Farmallgray »

Lyle,
Do you have any links to where you got info on the booth?

Martin Senour like to use 8:4:1 for single stage paint. It can also depend on what VOC regs the paint is made to meet.
3.5 VOC is usually reduced less than 5.0 VOC.

And everyone,
You may already know about this and I don't want to sound like a nervous nellie but if you are using paint with hardener, especially in a small booth like that, you should have a positive air respirator. At the very least get a full face respirator so your eyes are covered. Isocynates can get into your system through your eyes. I have had sickness from Isocynates twice and it isn't fun. It is like a really intense case of the worst flu you can imagine. Those were the only times in 16 years that I had to call in sick to work.Ever since I found out about this, I do all my painting outside. This still isn't ideal but at least with a slight breeze the isocynates dissipate pretty quick. And there is no kind of filter/respirator that can filter isocynates out of the air.
See my IH, Cub Cadet and tractor pulling youtube videos;
http://www.youtube.com/user/farmallgray

Lmercer
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First and Last Name: Lyle Mercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Farmallgray,

I didn't bookmark any of the sites. I just Googled homemade paintbooth and just started clicking away on the links.

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l palma
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by l palma »

Todd, That is why I paint outside.I use a box fan to blow away the overspray,not too high a setting, just enough to get the air moving.I find the best time is in the early evening.

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Dave C
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Dave C »

one thing to add to the paint booth... light light light light! its amazing how much better u can see outside in the sun then inside... when i go to my buddys autobody shop i have to wear sunglasses! and one last thing i found wetting the floor down will help as the overspray will be attracted to the water and it will keep the dust down.
Trying to save cubs... one at a time.......

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Trebor
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Trebor »

It is great to see all of the input on painting and paint booths. A thought on the paint booth. Would it work to put hinges midway on two sides to allow the booth to collapse for storage? I have space restraints that I'm sure others have as well. The suggestion of fans, filters and lights are dang near worth money. Quite amazing how much ability can be absorbed by participating in the forum.
“May you have the hindsight to know where you've been, The foresight to know where you are going, And the insight to know when you have gone too far”.

Lmercer
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First and Last Name: Lyle Mercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Trebor,

That's a good idea. I put mine together with screws so I figured I would just take them out that way I just have a stack of 2 X 4's to contend with.

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

So, last week I bought Iron Gard from the dealer to start spraying this weekend. They carried the IH thinner for it and a new Valspar hardener, Renew. They said most people just went and got an automotive hardener.

I checked with a couple of the local NAPA stores that I knew used to carry and mix paint, and neither did anymore and just had some stuff on the shelf, but couldn't tell me what might work.

I work close to a Sherwin Williams Auto Paint supplier so I went in there today. They were very reluctant to sell me anything to put in the Iron Gard paint as they were afraid as to how it would dry or stick. I did appreciate the fact that they just weren't interested in the sale. I asked them how much their paint was and it was almost 3X the Iron Gard.

Later I called them and asked if they could cross reference a NAPA # and if they could, I was going to buy some reducer and hardener from them and take my chances. When I got there, they offered to match the price of the Iron Gard so that they knew the reducer and hardener would be compatible.

I quickly called the implement dealer where I bought the paint and asked them if I could return it if it was unopened and they said I could. Sooooo, I bought the Sherwin Williams and will hopefully be trying it out this weekend.

This will be my 1st attempt, but I'm one of those guys who gets pretty anal in my research so I hope it all turns out.

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Well I mixed the Sherwin Williams paint at the ratio they recommended, 4:2:1. Well that was too thin and it didn't cover well and ran :x

So the next batches were at 4:1:1. It went on much better. Here is a few pics:
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I'm happy with the way it turned out, I just hope it dries!!

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Here is what I got painted after I got home late tonight. The 1st pic shows the correct color, the others change with the flash:

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Tomorrow night, the frame!! :D

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Painted the frame tonight. I thought I had done a good job. I held that gun every which way, but I just don't have enough good light. After I took the pictures, the flash shows what I missed. The problem is, I don't know how I'm gonna get to some of it, even if I use a detail gun:

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At least the seat mount came out nice:

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Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

While letting the frame dry and the paint to harden up, I decided to paint the bottom of the white parts outside. I figured any bugs wouldn't matter as it wouldn't be seen.

I got lucky and no bugs:

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Hopefully tomorrow night we move the frame out of the booth and I can finish painting all the yellow.

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l palma
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by l palma »

Looking good Lyle,
The yellow is hard to cover in one shot,you prolly need more light.

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

l palma,

You're right, I certainly could use more light. I noticed last night that I had a couple of dark spots showing through on the fenders, I originally thought it was a shadow, but it's not. Since I have to repaint the pieces that had runs from the 1st time, I think I'm going to wet sand the fenders and dust them again. :)

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

I decided to do some white tonight:

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I did encounter a problem on the hood. It was like it has oil on it. I had the same problem on one of the yellow pieces and after it dried, I sanded it and repainted it and it came out fine. I guess I'll redo the hood when I do the front end:

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Oh well, tomorrow I'm reshooting the yellow pieces that ran and I'm going to dust the fender pan again as there are a couple of dark spots.

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

I wet sanded and primed the hood today so it's ready to repaint, but I have to wait for the fender pan to dry as I reshot it yesterday to get rid of a few dark spots I had:

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I wish the bottom of the battery tray didn't look so bad. :oops:

I also reshot all the yellow that had runs and after I had everything cleaned up, I saw the tie-rods that I haven't painted yet. :o Oh well!!

Even though I planned on waiting a month before assembly, I couldn't help myself to mock things up a bit:

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Got to head out of town for a couple of days, so I'm done for a while. :beerchug:

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

It seems like it has been a while since I got anything done. I got the wheels sand blasted and primered:

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I did shoot some more white today:

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I figured since I had to shoot some white, I might as well as clean up some of the bolts and get them painted to match:

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Tomorrow the last of the yellow pieces!!

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mgonitzke
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by mgonitzke »

Tip for painting bolts (although it's probably too late): Try to get as thin of a coat of paint as possible on them, and put your wrench or socket in the finger of a latex glove when you reinstall. The paint is far less likely to chip that way.
Original, 582 w/ 18 hp Kohler Command, 682 w/ Kwik-Way loader, 782, 782D, 1872 My Cub Site

Lmercer
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First and Last Name: Lyle Mercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

Thanks Matt. It's not too late for the yellow ones!! :D

Lmercer
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by Lmercer »

I finished up all the yellow today:

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I also got the backs of the wheels painted white:

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The wheels came out looking great. I hope the fronts come out as good!!

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red82s
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Re: 1650 Fixes/Resto

Post by red82s »

I can't wait until you get it put together. It's gonna look awesome!
Adrian

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