CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

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CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:18 pm

Hey fellas! Wanted to mention that I converted my 1211 with Kohler Mag 12 into a 1711 using a great running Kohler KT 17 Series 2 engine. All I needed was an engine mount plate from a 1711 which I ordered off e bay for 14$ plus shipping. The Mag 12 incorporated a longer propeller shaft which I cut about 9/16" off, and figured I moved the front propeller shaft coupler back about 1 1/2". I kept the dual rag joint set up at both ends of the shaft. With the engine correctly mounted, and the shaft tightly secured at both ends, I drilled the new hold where she lay, which was an excellent jig in itself. I started with an 15/64" bit, and went ever slowly as not to touch the 1/4" I.D of the coupler. Took my time. When I had gone straight through and out the opposite side of the coupler, I then went to a 1/4" drill bit and only drilled just over half way through the shaft, again taking my time and not touching the coupler I.D . Supported the coupler with a bottle jack, and a piece of hardwood, and tapped the 1/4" coil pin right back where it came! From there, after removing all wires from the Mag 12, I referenced the Kohler KT Service Manual, and wired the basic ignition system with amp meter equipped. That's it! No frills. I'll wire my pto and lighting later. The KT charges quite well. I got a better used fuel pump and put a shut off valve both before and after the pump with inline fuel filter for pump engines. I noticed how full the engine oil was because there was so much gas, which is the reason I thought to try another pump, and so far SO good! I be rid of the Warlbro carb and put in a good Kohler carb off my other good running KT Series 2 engine. Needless to say, everything is spot on! I notice a completely different animal of a tractor now. More power to you!!

Thanks, John
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:15 am

A few more things I've done with this conversion. Once I gutted the 1211 wiring system, I pressure washed the chassis really good. Prior, I had replaced the trans fluid and filter. I had an old starter solenoid off a model 72 IH CC in which I mounted in a similar location found on most QL models. The solenoid actually bolted right to the steel steering tower where the relay used to be, on the outside left of the brake peddle. The solenoid mounted perfectly inside the tower, next to the single hydraulic spool valve. Three new rubber 90* boots finished off the install with a factory look. No more nonsense of having an exposed SS at the back of the tractor!! What a joke that idea is. I kept thinking something could happen back there while running tire chains, and you name it contacting the SS. But more was that I noticed that the ever faithful Triangle flange had been binding, I installed a new one of those as well as replacing two rag joints that served better replaced. Bonus was that all the wear on the tip of the propeller shaft going into the flange was cut away, ending up like having a new shaft! I discovered a weeping hydraulic release valve along the way that I swapped out with one I pulled from the scrap yard years ago. I ran through the procedures of taking any extra play out of the front axle, changed the oil, and got two bran new front tires from my scrap yard from 10$ each. One thing I noticed today was how the engine was acting with that new inline paper element fuel filter. Looked under the hood while running, and noticed the fuel filter canister empty. The engine kinda was acting like it could use a better, consistant flow of fuel, so I removed that filter and the engine does act a little better. But other than this, the new 1711 ( made in 1985 only ) will receive some cosmetic repairs. I did have a nice yellow steering wheel spinner that I got from Charlie that I put on as well. Hope I can find the time later to post a pic or two. Take care !
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby dag1450 » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:11 pm

Sounds like a nice upgrade! Good job
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby BigMike » Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:45 am

John, can you convert Dag to a working model?
:lol:
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby dag1450 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:46 pm

BigMike wrote:John, can you convert Dag to a working model?
:lol:

:roll: Oh brother.....look who finally got out of bed. Glad you can join us Mike!
Oh by the way....I work just fine except for my hips....and back...and my tennis elbow lately thank you very much. And I'm not even 50! :lol:
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:26 pm

dag1450 wrote:Sounds like a nice upgrade! Good job


So far so good! Thanks! Seems like a simple task, but it was quite an accomplishment for me. For all the time I spent learning about the different makes and models of Cub Cadet, my younger brother was kind of surprised all the pieces fit together to come up with something like this, lol! The project took me almost 3 days to do over the 4th Of July weekend. I stayed up late, or I'd get up at dawn and just could not be pulled away from the tractor. My wife told me I needed to eat lunch, I said I dident have time! This is my newest, and most powerful Cub Cadet I've ever had. I really can't complain being a IH fan for so long.
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:30 pm

BigMike wrote:John, can you convert Dag to a working model?
:lol:


:lol:

I don't know what to make of that!
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby mrbrown » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:29 am

Good job. I'm glad you did that instead of selling them. 82 series with twins are smooth mowers. Now you can start collecting Commands for the next one. Mike :D
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:50 am

IMG_0878.JPG


Some pictures of the tractor,

IMG_0875.JPG


IMG_0879.JPG


IMG_0877.JPG


Going to try it out this winter clearing the drive way. I'll need to get all the lighting working.

Thanks , John
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:56 am

mrbrown wrote:Good job. I'm glad you did that instead of selling them. 82 series with twins are smooth mowers. Now you can start collecting Commands for the next one. Mike :D


I just passed on a 2000 series I found in the scrap yard. I was so tempted to rescue it. The engine was CH18 I believe. Looked complete, however my wife would skin me alive if I start brining home more tractors, lol. Little does she know I got a 1970 Ford 140 coming that I got for free. I'm kind of awaiting to see if my brother gets a CCC 1210 he's had a line on now since Monday. Thanks for the complement!
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Sat Jul 13, 2019 8:01 am

6F5BFCA1-FC99-430A-8757-CD1B813D1D42.jpeg
Here is the solenoid mounted I thought it worked out good
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby BigMike » Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:21 am

“and my tennis elbow lately thank you very much. And I'm not even 50! :lol:
Yikes!
Dag in one of those little tennis skirts!!!!! :D
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:09 am

Hello guys! Good afternoon! Is everyone enjoying the summer heat, lol? I have a question or two. On my 1211 that is now a 1711, I wanted to install the rear lift system to it, but noticed there are no inside bushings welded to the frame, common to the QL models. What would be the alternative to installing these bushings? I have a parts QL parts frame that I considered removing the bushings from and welding them on to the 1711. Would there be a more simple, easier way of getting around my consideration? If so, what would that be?

I also had thoughts about installing a cast iron transmission, but I had thought I read somewhere that the gears in the current aluminum transmission in the 1711 have better cut gears, plus I have the axel studs instead of the IH rim bolts. My hydro controls are near perfect working condition, so I'm not really sure I want to do a trans swap anyway. Its more that I noticed how much less the rear end of the 1711 is and seems to be prone to more rear traction loss, guessing its because the engine and 10 pound mount plate bring it to about 122 pounds up front.

But I would like to come up with a solution to mount my rear lift system. On another note, today I installed the 1/4" rim spacers to the 1711 and am happy with the stance and looks of my 1711. I cant help to really like the tractor this 1711 is becoming! Hope to hear from you soon, and stay cool!

Many thanks, John
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby dag1450 » Fri Jul 19, 2019 5:02 am

Hi..are you referring to installing a cast iron rear end? I personally don't think I would go there but I only use my tractor for mowing. If your pulling heavy loads and feel your on the edge of destruction then that would be the next step. I think a more common problem with the aluminum rear is it can loosen from the frame. Adding a "bagger" plate to the rear of the frame adds a lot of protection from the rear working loose.
I'm sure some people install the cast iron rear just for fun...and that's fine too. It's all about having fun with these little guys....
Sorry if this is not what you were talking about.
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Fri Jul 19, 2019 12:16 pm

dag1450 wrote:Hi..are you referring to installing a cast iron rear end? I personally don't think I would go there but I only use my tractor for mowing. If your pulling heavy loads and feel your on the edge of destruction then that would be the next step. I think a more common problem with the aluminum rear is it can loosen from the frame. Adding a "bagger" plate to the rear of the frame adds a lot of protection from the rear working loose.
I'm sure some people install the cast iron rear just for fun...and that's fine too. It's all about having fun with these little guys....
Sorry if this is not what you were talking about.


Good advice taken. No problems with it so far, and I don't earn a living with the 1711 but it is my yard mule. I'll just keep a box 9/16" wrench handy and be sure to check the trans mounting and carrier bolts. But even the "Z" brackets on the QL CI trans often broke, so each has their own small issues perhaps. Are you familiar with a special bracket that bolts to the carrier-to-frame for added strength? If so, would you recommend them? Just a thought. (for now). I was looking at the rear lift support bushings on my QL parts frame, and it appears they are recessed into the hole thickness of the frame. Maybe some measurements will tell me a better story if this idea will work onto the 1711. Anyways, I got to get my 1450 up and into mowing service very soon. The QL 1000 currently being used for mowing duty needs a complete go-through as the engine lost a lot of mounting hardware, and has a mouse hotel in the blower housing among new gaskets and engine clean up. Not only is the 1450 more user friendly, but it has been completely looked at and just needs put back together. With a possible hernia operation in my future, I'm no longer carrying these engines on my shoulder, and what not. But back to the 1711, I'm not sure if the lower bracket off the 1450 for the sleeve hitch will work on the back of the 1711 trans yet.

Stay cool everyone! Thanks, John
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby dag1450 » Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:25 am

Those "bolts" are into aluminum so don't go crazy on them. You could torque them to proper spec then just check once and awhile with the wrench but not really turn the bolt.
The brackets...I don't have but yes I am familiar. I think exteme has a set. Tom Scott made his own with some simple steel for cheap. He posted about it here, u would just need to find it. All I have in my head was Steve willams called it a "Bruce brace" I remember when he coined the phrase....I threw up and laphed at the same time. If your not up on pop culture.... maybe Big Mike can fill you in on a Bruce brace :lol: :lol:
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:12 pm

Ok, thanks dag1450! I'll look into those braces a little later, I would order mine and save myself the time.
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Wed Sep 18, 2019 12:38 pm

New Update:

First, how's everyone been? I've noticed that the oil level has been rising ever so slightly since the conversion was done, completed with a new engine oil change. Though, I did fill the crank case just above the full mark on the dip stick, now its quite past where I filled! Some smoke is now noticeable now, where smoke was never before. Assuming its because we're over filled here. Knowing the history of these engines in that fuel likes to "some-how" find its way down into the engine crank case oil, I installed a fuel shut off after the mechanical fuel pump, and I always close the valve and let the engine starve it's self and shut down. The oil looks and feels wet, and like gasoline.

So, now I suspect the fuel pump is the problem. Though my 1711 engine and the rest of, seems to operate great. Would you recommend a shut off valve before the fuel pump? I'm going to try any way to see what I discover. I'm changing the engine oil this weekend. Any better ideas around this? I really like to take good care of my engine!

Is this a simple solution to this problem by having the fuel shut off valve before the pump?

Thank you for your time reading this!
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby dag1450 » Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:14 pm

Good job. Yeah I think the place for the shut off would be best after the tank and before anything else....so yes before the fuel pump. Fuel pump could be the culprit or a leaking carb needle. I had a bad needle seat fill the crankcase over a winter. With a flashlight you can look down in the bottom of the 90 under the air cleaner and if it's wet it's probably the needle or needle seat. Either way a shut off will be a good idea. I got in the habit of every time I start them to pull the dipstick to make sure my oil is not multiplying.
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby mrbrown » Fri Sep 20, 2019 7:20 am

Hi John, i have a mag 18 that would slightly overfill after setting. The oil was not gassey. After a couple oil changes and bypassing the pump i think it was the oil in the filter draining back into the case. I had a fuel shutoff before the pump. The pump looked new and worked great. It's still bypassed, run gravity and full tank, may go back one of these days. Mike
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby mrbrown » Fri Sep 20, 2019 7:35 am

mrbrown wrote:Good job. I'm glad you did that instead of selling them. 82 series with twins are smooth mowers. Now you can start collecting Commands for the next one. Mike :D

Might have to take back what i said earlier in the year. I'm now sitting on a 22 command with 400 hours. Looking for a trwactor, i want hydro lift. Mike lol
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:57 pm

IMG_0882.JPG




The weekend finally came, after a tuff week at work, lol! Got the engine oil changed a while ago today. Added a fuel shut off valve before the mechanical pump, I'm guessing on a longer period of time before the crank case oil starts to creep up past the full mark on the dip stick. My thinking is that if the fuel is leaking into the crank case from the pump, that it will do so while the tractor is being used. Now, I'll watch the area of the carb portion that connects to the lower air filter housing, to see if there is a trace of fuel laying in there. Though, with the engine mount plate being sloped down toward the steering box, and into the carb, I can't suspect there will be any puddle of fuel laying, but just wet as Dag1450 mentions. Maybe if this is the problem, I can swap out the needle or seat at some point. Time of operation may tell, lol! The above picture shows the two fuel valve shut off's I have on this 1711. Just cheepies, Briggs and Stratton. And the lower picture should be the oil change in progress, using Briggs and Stratton oil, a 48 ounce for $8.49 at T.S.C . Can't say enough how nice it is to post pictures here, thank you! :beer: Forgot to mention, no more exhaust smoke! :P
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:06 pm

mrbrown wrote:Hi John, i have a mag 18 that would slightly overfill after setting. The oil was not gassey. After a couple oil changes and bypassing the pump i think it was the oil in the filter draining back into the case. I had a fuel shutoff before the pump. The pump looked new and worked great. It's still bypassed, run gravity and full tank, may go back one of these days. Mike


My Series Two Kohler engine has the oil filter block off plate, as well as the plug for a sending unit, if that's correct in what I'm seeing, lol! I hear of new mechanical pumps going for $20 I guess from the net.
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Re: CCC 1211 Conversion to 1711

Postby JLazar » Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:17 pm

mrbrown wrote:
mrbrown wrote:Good job. I'm glad you did that instead of selling them. 82 series with twins are smooth mowers. Now you can start collecting Commands for the next one. Mike :D

Might have to take back what i said earlier in the year. I'm now sitting on a 22 command with 400 hours. Looking for a trwactor, i want hydro lift. Mike lol


I'm not sure what kind of tractor you're looking for your engine, but usually there are a few 82 Series around with blown Series One Kohler engines. I had a lead on a 582 non-special with a blown Briggs 16, but the guy was firm on his $200 price so I let that one be, especially since I wanted a twin 17 in it and had none, now I got two, lol! I think, for me I prefer the hydro with hydro lift, but still can't let go of the gear drives!!
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